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Poll: were the Irish beneficiaries of bad OT call?

Stepfan Taylor, KeiVarae Russell AP

As you may have seen and/or heard, Notre Dame’s thrilling overtime win over Stanford was not without controversy.

Following an Irish touchdown on its first possession of overtime that put the home-standing Domers up 20-13, Stanford proceeded to drive down inside the one-yard line and was facing a fourth-and-goal when Stepfan Taylor (no relation) was stuffed to preserve the Irish win.  Or, depending on your fan colors, crossed the goal line, robbing the Cardinal of what would’ve been, pending a successful extra point, a score that sent the game into a second overtime.

In the NBC broadcast booth, color analyst Mike Mayock indicated that he had thought the ball had broken the plane of the goal line prior to either Taylor’s forward progress being stopped or his knee hitting the ground.

On Twitter, former NFL head of officiating and current FOX analyst Mike Pereira wrote that “[w]e have looked at ND/STA last play from every angle & feel that it is a TD. Progress was not ruled & runner was not down. Ball broke [plane].”

However, upon further review  — by Pac-12 officials, incidentally — the ruling on the field was upheld, giving the Irish their sixth straight win to start the season and preserving their BcS hopes.  The thing is, was it actually a stop by the Irish defense?  See the clip below, starting at around the 1:20 mark:

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So, after viewing the highlight yet again, did the officials make the right call?  Or, did the Cardinal get jobbed by officials from its own conference?  Sound off like you got a pair below, and then head to the comments section to whine and/or bitch and/or moan.

 

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69 Responses to “Poll: were the Irish beneficiaries of bad OT call?”
  1. elwaysmilehighdenver says: Oct 13, 2012 9:20 PM

    Totally blown call! Replay showed that he rolled over the pile and extended the ball across the goal line. His elbow did not touch the ground as some nd homers have cried.

  2. kiopta1 says: Oct 13, 2012 9:22 PM

    Nope. Forward progress stopped, whistle blown, elbow down. Don’t try and turn this into a bush push.

  3. willtosqualor says: Oct 13, 2012 9:24 PM

    His elbow was down before the ball crossed the line. But good luck proving that to butt devastated ND haters.

  4. kiopta1 says: Oct 13, 2012 9:26 PM

    Stan still has a very good team and tons of football left to play.

  5. normtide says: Oct 13, 2012 9:28 PM

    I think it was a td, but the he was ruled down, and that is that. I predicted an ot game, but thought Stanford would get the win. Will be fun to watch how the season plays out for the Irish.

  6. gmenfan1982 says: Oct 13, 2012 9:29 PM

    Close call. I’m and ND fan and I expected the call to be reversed and ruled a td. I thought the whistle had blown but apparently not since it was reviewable. Tough call although i do side more with it being a td than not.

  7. 60oldschool says: Oct 13, 2012 9:30 PM

    can someone tell me what he ref’s ruled ?
    1. whistle blew stopping the play?
    2. didn’t cross the goal line with the ball?
    3. looks like he fumbled and an offensive lineman recovered, why is that not a touchdown ?

  8. 60oldschool says: Oct 13, 2012 9:32 PM

    kiopta1 says:Oct 13, 2012 9:22 PM

    Nope. Forward progress stopped, whistle blown, elbow down. Don’t try and turn this into a bush push.

    kiopta1 when did you hear the whistle blown ? i didnt hear it, or see his elbow down.

  9. jgater1981 says: Oct 13, 2012 9:34 PM

    It doesn’t matter if his elbow was down or not (it was). Whistle blew, ND players celebrated and THEN he put it over the line. Non story, made a story to get haters riled up.

  10. jgater1981 says: Oct 13, 2012 9:36 PM

    Also, oldschool, you can’t advance a fumble on 4th down, so it would have been down at line of scrimmage. ND wins.

  11. BrownsTown says: Oct 13, 2012 9:47 PM

    Didn’t see it…..don’t watch exhibition football on NBC.

  12. manchestermiracle says: Oct 13, 2012 9:48 PM

    ND benefited from hometown refereeing all game, so no surprise they kept ND from having to go to a 2nd OT. The only folks who think that wasn’t a TD are ND fans.

  13. gatorguru says: Oct 13, 2012 9:49 PM

    Stoops’ boys will pound em’.

  14. raysfan1 says: Oct 13, 2012 9:50 PM

    On the best view among the replay angles, a Notre Dame defender’s arm blocks any clear view of the Stanford running back’s elbow. It might have been down, but it might not.

    No, the running back’s momentum had not been stopped. No, he did not fumble the ball before crossing the goal line.

    The entire crux of the case is the runner’s elbow. Since it cannot be conclusively shown that it was or wasn’t down, the call on the field by the official has to stand. Therefore, ND wins.

  15. 50milessouthofdetroit says: Oct 13, 2012 9:52 PM

    4th down? i wasn’t so sure that stanford didn’t score on 2nd down

  16. kiopta1 says: Oct 13, 2012 9:52 PM

    Refs were PAC 12 by the way.

  17. thefiesty1 says: Oct 13, 2012 9:53 PM

    Yes! It was a TD. Officials blew whistle way too early.

  18. jayscarpa says: Oct 13, 2012 10:15 PM

    Nope

  19. ferg79 says: Oct 13, 2012 10:23 PM

    A win is a win, I’m a ND fan and thought it was a thrilling win and if it would have gone the other way then so be it move on to the next week and that is it football is a game of inches and Taylor didn’t get that one move on and GO Irish

  20. jgater1981 says: Oct 13, 2012 10:23 PM

    Home town refs? You mean PAC 10 refs, the same conference the Cardinal(s) are in?

  21. bill2018 says: Oct 13, 2012 10:24 PM

    No touchdown. Running backs momentum was stopped. He was only churning his legs and rolling around on the pile. The rule was put into place to keep him from getting hurt. A running back isn’t allowed 5 minutes of running in place to see if he is going to break free or not.

  22. vanmorrissey says: Oct 13, 2012 10:25 PM

    Did not hear whistle but even after replays no conclusive evidence to overturn the call. You had to get the one camera angle from the right side of the end zone and using that one it looked like he rolled on top of someone and crossed the plane, TD. But…that’s the way it goes.

  23. bill2018 says: Oct 13, 2012 10:26 PM

    Not a touchdown. A running back doesn’t get 5 minutes of churning his legs in place while lying on top of a pile to see if he can break free.

  24. ferg79 says: Oct 13, 2012 10:26 PM

    ND won game over move on to the next week

  25. frank booth says: Oct 13, 2012 10:28 PM

    It really doesn’t matter. Notre Dame’s schedule, which at first looked daunting, has actually been pretty pedestrian. Michigan isn’t that great this year, and Michigan State had it’s third loss this week, as did Miami.

    It was a decent win against a Stanford team that will reside in the back of the Top 25. Stanford is the best team that Notre Dame has played this season. ND will beat up on BYU next, but the Oklahoma game should at least be interesting.

  26. queenlivekillers says: Oct 13, 2012 10:53 PM

    Agreed, Frank Booth. Stanford got jobbed on the call, no matter whose conference the officials came from. However, ND played their asses off, to give credit where it is due. They could have folded at any number of points. Stanford could not decide if they were the team that beat USC or the team that lost to Washington.

    ND will benefit from a schedule that is not as hard as advertised in the preseason and some cutthroat competition among the teams ahead of them in the polls. However, as in past years, in a major bowl when they face a team that has it’s sh*t together, they will be issued a reality check.

  27. kiopta1 says: Oct 13, 2012 10:58 PM

    The main threats left for ND are BYU, OK, and USC.

  28. ryantbury says: Oct 13, 2012 11:05 PM

    If you can’t get 4 yrds on 4 straight rushes you don’t deserve to win anyways

  29. pemory says: Oct 13, 2012 11:07 PM

    The problem with this is that the entire thing was a mess from the get-go. First, Stanford called back-to-back incredibly unimaginative smash-mouth runs right up the gut in to a very strong ND defensive line. Everyone in the stadium knew exactly what they were going to do. Then, on the 4th-down play the referees blew it by essentially not doing anything. Neither the umpire, nor the head linesman made any ruling–they each just looked at the ground. And this is all exacerbated by the fact that refs (in both college and pro) love to let runners in short-yardage situations twist and turn and grasp for extra real estate forever (unless the runner fumbles–then they will typically lean on the “phantom whistle” excuse and call the runner down). All of this nonsense could have been avoided if the head linesman has simply ruled that the runner’s forward progress had been stopped (it appeared to me that it had); however, since he didn’t, the door is now open for everyone to argue and second-guess the ending.

  30. badgerbuck says: Oct 13, 2012 11:14 PM

    I love the Irish but lets face it he scored sometimes being a fan means sometimes being blind to any thing that goes against your teams, saying that the Irish won the game but believe me they are still going to lose three if not four more games this year.

  31. kiopta1 says: Oct 13, 2012 11:21 PM

    What four teams on the schedule beat them?

  32. kiopta1 says: Oct 13, 2012 11:21 PM

    Also lose more games?

  33. nightrain42 says: Oct 13, 2012 11:22 PM

    That’s the NBC contract influence at its best. $$$$ talks…the truth walks

  34. Deb says: Oct 13, 2012 11:24 PM

    How on earth were those of us who didn’t see the game supposed to gauge anything from that sorry clip?? If you want our opinions, please provide a genuine replay clip–I know NBC has access to those–that shows the PLAY IN QUESTION, perhaps from a couple of angles. I didn’t need to see a bloody highlight reel. Good grief.

  35. badgerbuck says: Oct 13, 2012 11:24 PM

    Oklahoma,Boston college,USC ,and bowl game

  36. emperorzero says: Oct 13, 2012 11:41 PM

    I’m a Notre Dame fan and I was surprised it wasn’t ruled a touchdown. There were no whistles and it was impossible to see if the runner’s elbow was down or not. I agree with the above posters who mention that the refs love to let a guy churn and wiggle forever and a day until he finally fumbles the ball and then they’ll say the play was dead. I thought his forward progress was stopped, but I can see why some think it wasn’t.

  37. manchestermiracle says: Oct 13, 2012 11:47 PM

    kiopta1: All the article indicated was the review officials were from the PAC12.

    jgator: PAC10 is so two years ago.

    Perhaps the whole crew was from the PAC12, but the bias on the field was in ND’s favor all game. Maybe the refs were trying too hard to show they weren’t favoring Stanford. The last call of the game was still bullshit.

  38. polegojim says: Oct 13, 2012 11:49 PM

    Sorry… ND is the luckiest team in the country.

    Lot’s of them 4-leaf clovers in the pads or something.

  39. John Taylor says: Oct 14, 2012 12:03 AM

    @ Deb: I give you guys what I get. If you don’t like it, go somewhere else. Please.

  40. jgater1981 says: Oct 14, 2012 12:09 AM

    The PAC 10 refs missed a hold every time ND rushed the QB. Give me a break on that. ND won, fair and square. Would have won by more if the PAC 10 refs knew what a hold looked like.

  41. frank booth says: Oct 14, 2012 12:11 AM

    John Taylor says:Oct 14, 2012 12:03 AM

    @ Deb: I give you guys what I get. If you don’t like it, go somewhere else. Please.
    =================================

    Yeah, but John, you’re asking people to review the clip, and then “sound off like you’ve got a pair”. Yet the clip that you have provided is useless.

    The complaints are valid. Nice job telling your audience/customers to go somewhere else when you supplied useless video and asked people to comment it. Take some responsibility instead of trying to obfuscate by telling others to go somewhere else.

  42. normtide says: Oct 14, 2012 12:16 AM

    Yea, good thing John wasn’t posting that to Luke Fickle’s wife.

  43. pedagoguish says: Oct 14, 2012 12:32 AM

    The Irish were the beneficiaries of incompetent play by Stanford quarterback Nunes. What a shame! The Cardinal have all the tools they had a year ago save one: a field general who can make a connection on third down. Andrew, how we miss thee!

  44. bigbuckeye76 says: Oct 14, 2012 12:47 AM

    I have watched it a few times…..I don’t hear a whistle. Looks to me like he is stuffed, rolls to his left and reaches the ball across the goal line while lying on top of a ND player. I would think that would be way too quick for a whistle to blow..

    I would say 75/25 it’s a TD..

  45. vincentbojackson says: Oct 14, 2012 1:25 AM

    I wondered whatever happened to the NFL replacement refs.

    Nice work fellas!

  46. techvet says: Oct 14, 2012 2:38 AM

    Pac12 officials on the field, Big East officials in the press box. Forward progress was stopped. Game over.

  47. lanzurrah says: Oct 14, 2012 3:57 AM

    Terrible call. It was a TD.

  48. footballleprechaun says: Oct 14, 2012 4:11 AM

    Whistle or no. Taylor was DOWN his (knees) and body were on top of a player who was on his back making the player part of the ground The crux of the situation is that his progress was STOPPED prior to his sqirming and twisting and extending the ball into the endzone or was he just levitating in mid air! Call it what it is A TREMENDOUS NOTRE DAME GOAL LINE STAND!!!!!!!!

  49. bigbuckeye76 says: Oct 14, 2012 8:05 AM

    I have never heard that the orientation of the player you are lying on can determine if you are down.

  50. myopinionisrighterthanyours says: Oct 14, 2012 9:01 AM

    @footballleprechaun:

    You are SO wrong it is not even funny. You are NEVER down when you are on top of another player, regardless of how that player is situated. You are only down when something other than your hand or foot hits the ground. Rewatch the Michael Dyer play from the BcS Championship game a couple years ago.

  51. pjofar77 says: Oct 14, 2012 10:03 AM

    ND was gifted a win they did not deserve on that play, but I am sure ND fans are fine with that. Just watch out for karma coming to you the rest of the season

  52. beedubyatoo says: Oct 14, 2012 10:54 AM

    And the Packer fans are called whiners after the fiasco in Seattle. At least there was little doubt that the officials totally blew that one.

  53. Deb says: Oct 14, 2012 1:28 PM

    @frank booth …

    Thank you. I’ve wasted a lot of keystrokes defending CFT’s writers through the years. But God forbid I question why there was no mention of a player injury that was serious enough to have both teams take knees to end the game so he could get to the hospital–a game involving the top-ranked team and another FBS team. I simply thought it odd there was no mention of that incident while a player sitting on the sidelines merited an article. That got me slapped down on one thread. I came here just to read what others thought about a game I didn’t see. But since I was provided a clip, thought that clip should show something relevant … and now I’m slapped down again.

    I don’t think it’s the commenters who need to grow a pair.

  54. rcali says: Oct 14, 2012 3:15 PM

    If you leave it up to the officials to determine your future, it’s your fault to begin with.

  55. irishking says: Oct 14, 2012 3:52 PM

    Tough loss for Stanford bad call or not. Even had it been ruled a TD, Stanford could have blown the extra point. Either way, the odds weren’t with Stanford in OT. Anyway, I extend my condolences to the Cardinal on its loss.

  56. seamus0317 says: Oct 14, 2012 6:48 PM

    The head linesman comes running in to mark the spot of forward progress – end of story!

  57. natemccullough says: Oct 14, 2012 7:07 PM

    I am a Notre Dame fan. I saw the replay and thought the ruling on the field would be over turned. Here is why it wasn’t in my opinion. It has to be indisputable evidence but it was unclear about whether or not his arm made contact with the ground. So ruling on the field stood as called. If your a Notre Dame fan you are glad and if you are a Stanford fan you are mad.

  58. artisan3m says: Oct 14, 2012 8:23 PM

    I officiated for 26 years (never NFL) but the ruling on forward progress is the same in the NFL as in NCAA. Progress had been stopped before the ball crossed the plane. If you review the film, the linesman was coming in to mark the ball short of the line to gain. It was his call to make and he judged progress stopped short of the goal line. It was the proper call if the film is reviewed and there was no sufficient evidence to overturn the ruling on the field. Notre Dame wins, Stanford is pissed, and next week is here.

  59. pricecube says: Oct 14, 2012 11:30 PM

    @Deb… JohnTaylor… frankbooth et al

    I realize this is a dead issue at this point …

    but this shows the final play from two angles… It gives a little more credence to the idea that it might have been a TD in the second angle…

    but I still do not think it is conclusive… I cannot tell if he is down or not … He could be on top of bodies … so I do not think that is technically down … but without conclusive video you go with the call on the field… which was that it was not a TD… I don’t know. So rather than sounding off like “I got a pair” I am firmly grounded in the penumbra of ambivalence…

    I like both schools but am a fan of neither… so I have no pair to put behind this cause… I am a proverbial eunuch on this one.

  60. Deb says: Oct 15, 2012 12:18 AM

    @pricecube …

    Thank you so much for that clip of the play in question. Now that I’ve finally seen it, I agree with your assessment. It doesn’t seem conclusive enough to overturn the field ruling that he was stopped short of the goal line. But if the field ruling had been TD, I don’t think it would be conclusive enough to overturn that ruling, either.

  61. footballleprechaun says: Oct 15, 2012 3:54 AM

    Thank you >my opinionis…… But the real deL of the ND goal lind stand is if you watch the vlip with sound the ref blew the whistle when Taylor was knocked back thereby STOPPING FORWARD PROGRESS Zeke Motta was in on the stop and after the whistle and hearing said whistle zoomed away toward center of field or sideline or where ever KNOWING PLAY WAS BLOWN DEAD AND IRISH HELD!!!!!! ,Play should never have been reviewed

  62. jertrain1 says: Oct 15, 2012 6:13 AM

    For all you said football(i.e. Notre Dame enthusiasts/apologists) The official said NO WHISTLE was blown ending the play. How could forward progress be stopped when the RB was atop other players and never touch the ground! It was a blown call by the officials and replay booth!!

  63. normtide says: Oct 15, 2012 7:38 AM

    The bottom line at this point is, game is over and Irish win.

  64. onbucky96 says: Oct 15, 2012 4:01 PM

    FIX!

  65. asellnic says: Oct 15, 2012 6:29 PM

    In my opinion, the officials’ video review of the call was an issue of burden of proof. Is there enough irrefutable evidence to overturn the call? I don’t think so. By looking at the replay, it can be justifiably argued that his forward progress was stopped AND his elbow possibly hit the ground (a defender’s leg is blocking Taylor’s elbow, so this second point has to be inferred from the jerking motion of Taylor’s body which indicates elbow contact with the ground).

    However, if this play had been ruled a touchdown for Stanford, I don’t think there would be enough evidence to overturn that call either — no clear view of Taylor’s elbow hitting the ground and forward progress is sometimes a judgement call.

    The ruling on the field stands.

  66. godzilla111111 says: Oct 15, 2012 8:22 PM

    Stop the censorship you gutless left wing control freaks.
    MSNBC your Master-commie rot 24/7.

  67. jintzforever says: Oct 15, 2012 9:10 PM

    Refs blew it. Idiots.

  68. mavajo says: Oct 16, 2012 9:43 AM

    It was a correct call, but a bad call.

    Forward progress was stopped. That typically means the ref should blow the whistle and end the play. So in that sense, it was the correct call.

    However, we’re talking about a goal line play here in the final seconds of the game. The refs should have let that play out. So in that sense, it was a bad call.

  69. 808raiderinparadise says: Oct 16, 2012 5:34 PM

    THE REFS BLEW IT… the whistle that is.

    You can’t give a RB a TD when he is stopped dead of forward progress for a good 3 seconds on top of a pile. It’s just stupid, he didn’t earn a TD he just spun and rolled over and reached in after the players started letting off to celebrate when they heard a whistle.

    Sorry thats not a TD, made no progress with the ball until after players were peeling off.

    I understand … but you can’t tell me he made a clear path to goaline without being held up for 3 seconds on a pile with no gain.

    he got stuffed, more than once might I add.

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